Quiz Hands - the 5 Lines of Defense

grizz: Hi everybody, thanks for attending another of a series of lessons on Defense.  
grizz: Chat logs and hand records are stored in your computer for later review.  For information on how to retrieve them, go the BIL homepage or email me.
grizz: I teach private individual, pair, and small group lessons.  If you would like to know more please email me at Grizz@GrizzBridge.com.
grizz: Archives of previous sessions are available at GrizzBridge.com, on the Lessons and Archives page.
grizz: There will be lots of questions.  I want to address them all, but in a manner helpful to all, so please ask them in open chat.  
grizz: As always i encourage participation by all kibs
grizz: So jump right in with a comment, question, or bid at any time, but please do it in open chat...
grizz: ...since I can't always respond to private chat.
grizz: All of you have been taught that when declaring a hand you should stop and plan the play before touching any cards at Trick 1. 
grizz: That is excellent advice, and I urge all of you to follow it.
grizz: The same advice also applies to the defenders and even more so than for declarer.
grizz: Because declarer can see his hand and dummy, all of his combined partnership assets.  
DougC43: a general question/observation about lessons:  is it important (and i think it probably is), if the student wants to pursue a particular school/style of bidding, to find a teacher who is sold on that style?
grizz: yes, i would agree with that
DougC43: sorry, didn't realize the lesson had started :(
grizz: np  :)
grizz: But defenders do not enjoy that advantage.
grizz: Opening leader in particular is at a tremendous disadvantage, having to play before seeing dummy.
grizz: And then for the balance of the hand the defenders can see their hand and dummy, but must make inferences from the bidding, play and defensive signals.
grizz: There are only 5 basic types of defensive strategy at the beginning of a hand.
grizz: By the way, these concepts are out of the book "How The Experts Win At Bridge" by Burt Hall and Lynn Rose-Hall.
grizz: By way of review, and for those who are new here, the 5 lines of defense are:
grizz: 1.  Force declarer to ruff, and lose control of his own trump suit.
grizz: 2.  Active defense.
grizz: 3.  Passive defense.
grizz: 4.  Reduce ruffing power.
grizz: 5.  Create trump tricks.
grizz: Commit those 5 phrases to memory, because you will use them for the rest of your bridge life.
grizz: We have looked at Forcing, Active and Passive defense, Reduce ruffing power and Create Trump Tricks for 5 weeks, and started quiz hands last week.
grizz: Let us review the conditions for those strategies briefly, and then get into more quiz hands.
grizz: 1.  Force declarer to ruff, and lose control of his own trump suit.
grizz: There are 4 conditions in which the Forcing Defense can work.  They are:
grizz: a.  Declarer has a 2-suiter.
grizz: b.  Any time you have 4 trumps, or think partner might.
grizz: c.  Declarer is in a 4-3 or 5-2 trump fit.
grizz: d.  Any time the long trump hand can be forced to ruff early in the play of the hand.
grizz: 2.  Active defense.
grizz: Here are the general conditions that point the way to Active Defense:
grizz: a.  Any time tricks can go away, such as on a long side suit in either op hand.
grizz: b.  Declarer's side suit is breaking favorably.
grizz: c.  Ops have bid strongly, showing slam interest.
grizz: d.  One op has a long running suit, such as a Gambling 3NT bid showing a running 7+ card suit.
grizz: 3.  Passive defense.
grizz: a.  Ops have not bid a strong side suit.
grizz: b.  Declarer is strong, and dummy is weak.
grizz: c.  There is a misfit in key suits.
grizz: d.  Opening leader has no suit to lead against NT.
grizz: e.  You are defending 6NT or any grand slam.
grizz: f.  Ops have stumbled into a game.
grizz: 4.  Reducing Ruffs
grizz: 1.  Ops are playing in a partial or complete misfit.
grizz: 2.  The auction suggests shortness in dummy.
grizz: 3.  Defense is strong in all other suits.
grizz: 5.  Creating Trump Tricks:
grizz: 1.  Ruffing declarer's tricks:
grizz: a.  You are short in any unbid suit.
grizz: b.  You are long in ops' side suit, both bid and raised.
grizz: Then partner must be short in that suit.
grizz: c.  You have a weak hand, and no better line of defense.
grizz: 2.  Promoting trump tricks:
grizz: a.  Trump promotion
grizz: b.  Trump uppercut
grizz: Wow, that's a lot to remember!
grizz: For those of you who are new, we spent a session on each of these topics, and archives are on my website.
grizz: Are there any questions?
grizz: Now let's get to the quiz hands.
grizz: Knowing what the rules are is one thing, but being able to apply them at the table is quite different.
grizz: Here is where theory collides with reality, and the results are not always pretty!
grizz: In theory, there's no difference between theory and practice.  
grizz: In practice, there is.  :)
PedroG: LOL
MtlQueCan: )
grizz: You may kib all 4 hands to get a bird's eye view, or just West and dummy to get a more realistic view of the problem.
DougC43: how do we choose?
grizz: click on the yellow gear at the bottom of the screen
DougC43: gottit ... thx
grizz: Sitting West, how would you defend this hand?
analisals: Hi Dorothy!
grizz: The auction tells the story here
robzim: lead an unbid suit?  
bwd1: lead a small S whilst I have A of clubs
robzim: I should say lead THE unbid suit
grizz: any time ops have bid 2 suits strongly, there is a good chance that your side suit tricks will go away
kyno40: lead s or d that is the question seeing all cards you should lead a s
DougC43: there could be some concern that the !CA trick could go away if S is very short in clubs; maybe lead that?
baddeck: take the ace of clubs and set up your king sp
grizz: almost right - set up the !s while you still have the !cA for an entry
grizz: if West opens with the !cA, the suit is set up in dummy for discards
DougC43: right
grizz: and S can pitch his losing !ss on the good !cs
grizz: so we have a situation similar to NT defense
grizz: where you set up your slow winners while you still have entries to cash them
DougC43: makes good sense ... what label does it get?  Aggressive?
grizz: Active Defense, #2  above
DougC43: sry, "active" i mean
grizz: if S has the !SAQ, West was not going to cash the K anyway
grizz: so either you win with this line, or you don't lose
grizz: and that's about as good as it gets in this game!
grizz: this one is relatively easy for W to figure out
grizz: he knows about the long !c suit in dummy
grizz: and he is looking at the A, so the suit won't run right away
grizz: so the choice was between a !s and !d 
grizz: and this was a case where a risky lead from an honor was indicated
grizz: do we have any questions on that one?
basically->Club: and I would be dumb enough to lead that !D10.....~~~~~~~~
grizz: :)    then 6!h rolls
analisals: he had to hope that pard had the queen ?
grizz: y
grizz: no guarantees here
DougC43: "never lead from a king" ... unless you want to win   lol
grizz: but if S has the Q, it does not cost a trick
basically: yes....aren't leads under a K rather risky as a general thought?
PedroG: NO
grizz: y, it's one of those rules that is wrong part of the time
kyno40: oh yes
grizz: here is an expert tip -
basically: so the trick is finding the 'right' time :)
grizz: experts do not expect intermediates to underlead Kings
grizz: so they almost always guess right at Trick 1
maysie: rofl - and then they tell us OFF
kyno40: :)
grizz: but experts frequently underlead Kings, and that levels the playing field   :)
grizz: one other situation where you might underlead a K in a suit that pard did not bid
grizz: you know that a side suit is breaking favorably, or a key finesse is onside
grizz: and you want to put declarer to the guess before he knows anything about the hand
grizz: but in any case, you should have a good reason for underleading a K
wyoming33: wouldnt it cost a trick if south has the AQ and you lead from the K- here you are hoping that your pard has the Q
grizz: S has no reason to take the hook, except for practice - the losers go away on !cs
grizz: any other questions?
mick357: might you look at it this way; in a slam situation you look for quick tricks, leading from the ks  with help from p may make the a s played and then he had the a c to get back in?
grizz: exactly
grizz: it might win, and probably can't lose
mick357: right
grizz: but any other lead gives away the contract
grizz: look at it another way
grizz: it's a matter of timing, or "tempo"
grizz: the defense leads first, so it has the tempo
grizz: a passive lead surrenders tempo
grizz: an active lead tries to use tempo constructively
grizz: and this hand is a perfect illustration
grizz: if defense does not set up that !s trick right away, it goes bye bye on the !cs
grizz: ready for another hand?
FleuretteD: y
robzim: yes sir :)
basically: yes....thank you for great explianations
ydannac: y
grizz: first a word about this auction
grizz: many of you know this already, but some don't
grizz: it is almost always right to bid 4!s over 4!h
grizz: though maybe not at unfavorable vul
lauriexx: should it be east or west who knows to go to 4 spades?
grizz: that bid puts maximum pressure on ops
grizz: who must decide whether to pass, X or compete
grizz: and here is another good rule about competitive auctions
grizz: generally speaking, if our side opens and bids freely to game, it is "our" hand
grizz: and ops are just being nuissances
grizz: so the rule is that ops cannot play undoubled if they outbid us
grizz: either we compete, or we X
grizz: in this case, S does not know whether to compete or X
grizz: if he knew, he would do it
grizz: but here he needs partner's vote on the matter
grizz: so this is what is known as a "Forcing Pass"
grizz: and N must decide whether to X or compete
grizz: N has some defensive values and the trump Ace
grizz: so X is sure to get a positive score
grizz: but unless it's down 3, that is less than the value of a vul game
grizz: so N flips a coin and competes
grizz: ok, you are all sitting W.  what is your line of defense, and what do you lead?
grizz: in this case, it is wrong to open your own suit!
grizz: N has a !c suit, so the KQ in West are badly located
grizz: so we go to Active Defense
bjh346: how do u know that it's wrong to open ur own suit?
grizz: because ops have a good 5+ long side suit to pitch losers on
grizz: so we need to set up a secondary winner while we still have an entry
kyno40: can not lead !c because is south would have !c ace he would have cuebid 5!c after 4s ?
grizz: notice that this works even if E has the !sA, rather than the !da
grizz: here are a couple ways it could go:
grizz: then defense still gets a !d and !c
grizz: here is a good example of finessing dummy - pard must have led from the Q, since would never underlead an Ace in an unbid suit
grizz: so defense gets 2!d and a !c
grizz: let's see what happens if defense starts their suit, !ss
grizz: now defense gets only 1!d
grizz: any questions on this one?
DougC43: yes
grizz: fire away
JohnnyHiLo: so law of total tricks wasnt too accurate on this one
grizz: no, as Mike Lawrence says it's wrong 60% of the time
DougC43: on one hand, it's wrong to lead your own suit (sometimes) ... otoh, if you don't lead p's suit, your in trouble with her ... er, him
grizz: still it's a good guideline for intermediates
JohnnyHiLo: 5h can make or only be down 1
JohnnyHiLo: 5s has plenty of their trump and is down 2
kyno40: only !d lead defeats it
wyoming33: takes great def to set it - 4!S down several
grizz: imho, the LOTT is a good guideline until you develop good enough bridge judgment to know when not to follow it
analisals: so here you didn't lead out the queen? that wuld not work?
AofHearts->Club: if you have the A in your suit can you lead it?
grizz: it is bad practice to lead aces - they catch air
grizz: aces were made for taking kings and queens
FleuretteD: if partner shows 4 trumps and we have 6 leading our suit is useless ?
wyoming33: because you can stop a !C run - have a chance to try to set up a trick somewhere
baccib: elementary question:  looking at your hand, how do you know to bid 5H
grizz: be forewarned - if you don't lead partner's suit and your defense doesn't work, you may lose the post mortem
grizz: but if you always lead pard's suit, ops will make some contracts that they would not with other lines of defense
grizz: one other thought about this hand
bjh346->Club: good lesson
grizz: NS heard all the !s bids, and must be prepared for a !s lead
grizz: so expect 3-0 split, or ops have the A
l_novice1: your web address grizz?
grizz: click on my name box  :)
grizz: i think i missed a question a while back, what was it?
analisals: I asked if you lead ghe diamond queen would it work?
baccib: forgive me but I dont understand how you knew to bid 5H with that hand teaching board 10
grizz: on this layout the !DQ out would work
grizz: but on many others it would not
DougC43: this is a suit contract ... in a NT contract, would you lead your own suit a higher % of the time?
grizz: great question
grizz: if pard bids and ops play in NT, should you lead pard's suit?
grizz: yes!   unless you have both a good suit of your own, and an outside entry
grizz: which is almost never
kyno40: about the lead  wowhy not to  lead cl if south has !c ace would he bid 5!c after 4s > pl.
grizz: could be, sure
j915->Club: how does dia q work 
DougC43: it's good that BBO is remote because i'd be up for murder charges if one particular p had been in the same room!
grizz: though N bid !cs here, so is the big favorite to have the A
grizz: lol
j915: don't we need 2dia and club to set
grizz: right
j915: then dia q is bad
grizz: indeed, the Q does not work
grizz: another kib asks: forgive me but I dont understand how you knew to bid 5H with that hand teaching board 10
wyoming33: right has J10 in dummy
grizz: 5!h was a calculated risk
PedroG: LOL
robzim: LOL
grizz: that 5!h would make
grizz: but 5!sX would be down less than 450
basically: doesn't 4!S E/W go down?
l_novice1: så här kallt har det inte vart på hela vintern 
wyoming33: donw 2 X vul = 500 less than vul game
grizz: playing in 4!sX, defense takes:
grizz: 1!s
grizz: 2!h
grizz: 1!c
grizz: and 1!d
grizz: down 2 for 500
grizz: less than the value of the vul !h game
grizz: so 5!h was a risk
grizz: but a calculated risk
grizz: ready for another hand?
kyno40: y pl.
ydannac: y
grizz: 3!s is a limit raise here
grizz: Pretend you are East this time.  Partner leads the !HQ.  What next?
grizz: hint:  there is no long side suit here
grizz: so tricks are not in danger of going away
wyoming33: every time you break a new suit - lose how many tricks?
grizz: those of you kibbing just one hand and dummy, plz switch to East
PedroG: 1/2
grizz: with no clear plan for the defense, default to Passive
DougC43: someone explained it to me before you arrived!   lol
grizz: that is, avoid breaking new suits for declarer
grizz: make him do his own work
kyno40: lead tr. K
grizz: if E returns a !d here, S takes 3!d tricks
grizz: and a !c takes S off the guess about which way to take the hook
grizz: now S must still guess which way to take the !c hook
kyno40: are there any rules most of the time i get it wrong
grizz: here is a crafty declarer play, and an equally crafty defense play
grizz: S has no intention of hooking the !C this way, unless W covers
wyoming33: :) 
grizz: and W plays possum   :)
grizz: sure, the book says to cover if pard might have a card that can be promoted
grizz: but a cagey declarer will give the ops the opportunity to make a mistake by playing that way, in absence of other information about the suit
grizz: so this contract makes
grizz: but no overtricks
DougC43: what did defense have to do in diamonds to set it?
Dianne0516: How do you know not to cover with Q64?
grizz: but if E returns either minor at Trick 2, then S makes an overtrick
LadyStar17: !D!DSuper   super lesson
grizz: there is no defense that beats this one
DougC43->Club: i see ... it's not about setting but about denying the overtrick
grizz: this hand is about playing a defense that will not give away an extra overtrick
grizz: and the overtrick can be the difference between 65% and 27%, in terms of matchpoints
grizz: or in BAM play
kyno40: the other q  pl. with lets say n hand 5tr anf less then 10 points you jump to 4 straight away ?
grizz: any final questions?
Dianne0516: How do you know not to cover with Q64?
PedroG: no TY Pete great lesson has usual
grizz: good question
DougC43: are there some players then constitutionally more suited to IMPs that MPs?
grizz: sure
grizz: IMPs is more like playing for money
grizz: your own money, that is   :)
wyoming33: definitely - - hate MPs
grizz: back to the Qxx question
grizz: would S lead the J if pard had the T?
DougC43: so caution tends to be rewarded more at IMPs than at MPs, would you say?
sascha3: thx:) great lesson
j915->Club: if you jump to 4 you tell pard you have no def you have 2aces so go slow
grizz: that is the only way that a card could be promoted if you cover with the Q
Dianne0516: :)
kyno40: i think MP s is the best game because it lets you know if you improve or not 
grizz: true, but if you play MP bridge for money, bring lots of it  :)
kyno40: i know :)
grizz: because in MPs you will risk going down if there might be an overtrick
grizz: but in IMPs that is insanity
leonora3: greed is a terrible thing LOL
grizz: :)
grizz: That concludes today's lesson, and next week we will continue quiz hands on these different lines of defense at the table.
ladygolf: thanks Pete for lesson
Dianne0516: Thanks so much Pete
grizz:  If anybody needs help retrieving the hand records or chat log, please email me at Grizz@GrizzBridge.com.   
whiz: great lesson as always  ty  :)
dmfav: thanks -- this was very helpful!
leonora3: tx
terrierx2: thank you
->whiz: :)
Campus61: tk u Pete for ur lesson
DougC43: so if you're cautious by nature you'll like imps better
basically->Club: thanks
->Campus61: :)
nyleh: thanks for lesson
kyno40: but you tend to play much more hands in NT then playing IMP sJohnnyHiLo: would he lead the j if east had the 10?
glogo: ty
grizz: Thanks for your interest and participation, and I hope to see you next week.
cdt: Thanks Pete great as usual :)
wyoming33: thanks - 
grizz: Thanks also to Maureen, Rosemary, Fred and the wonderful people at BBO who make this all possible.
AofHearts: tx Grizz for lesson :)
kyno40: Thank you great as always
grizz: Thanks all for coming, i'll see you in a week
DougC43: yes, good stuff
JohnnyHiLo: good deal
grizz: Bye now
boeh: thanks