grizz: Hi everybody, thanks for attending another in a series of lessons on Defense. grizz: Chat logs and hand records are stored in your computer for later review. For information on how to retrieve them, go the BIL homepage or email me at Grizz@GrizzBridge.com. grizz: I teach private individual, pair, and small group lessons. If you would like to know more please email me at Grizz@GrizzBridge.com. grizz: Archives of previous sessions are available at GrizzBridge.com, on the Lessons and Archives page located at: http://www.grizzbridge.com/Lessons_and_Archives.php grizz: More than 50 sessions are logged there now, with lots of good information. grizz: There will be lots of questions. I want to address them all, but in a manner helpful to all, so please ask them in open chat. grizz: If I forget a question while answering another, please remind me. grizz: I encourage participation by all kibitzers grizz: So jump right in with a comment, question, or bid at any time, but please do so in open chat. grizz: The opening lead depends on your defensive strategy - as in chess, you must be thinking several moves ahead. grizz: There are only 5 basic types of defensive strategy at the beginning of a hand. grizz: These concepts are out of the book "How The Experts Win At Bridge" by Burt Hall and Lynn Rose-Hall, the Bridge Book of the Year in 1997. grizz: By way of review, and for those who are new here, the 5 lines of defense are: grizz: 1. Force declarer to ruff, and lose control of his own trump suit. grizz: 2. Active defense, go get your own tricks. grizz: 3. Passive defense, let the lead come to you. grizz: 4. Reduce ruffs. grizz: 5. Create trump tricks. grizz: Again, if you need review on the 5 Lines of Defense check out http://www.grizzbridge.com/Lessons_and_Archives.php grizz: Scroll down the page until you find those lessons under the BIL listings. grizz: Briefly, here are the lead guidelines for each of these different strategies: grizz: 1. Forcing defense - lead your side's strongest suit. grizz: 2. Active defense - also, lead your side's strongest suit. grizz: 3. Passive defense - top of a sequence, or a worthless suit grizz: 4. Reduce ruffs - lead a trump grizz: 5. Create trump tricks - lead away your own or toward partner's shortness. grizz: So choosing a lead depends on what your defensive game plan is, referring back to the 5 Lines of Defense. grizz: When you know WHAT you intend to accomplish, it is easier to decide HOW to get it done. grizz: This week we are going to continue looking at example hands and auctions, consider defensive plans and choose leads. grizz: These example hands are not predealt, they are random. grizz: So I have not analyzed them, rather we are all looking at them for the first time. grizz: The bidding will be done by the bots, though I must sit in one of the seats during play to control the pace. grizz: I have no idea who the declarer will be or which seat will be on lead, so you may kibitz all 4 hands. grizz: We will put our heads together and come up with a defensive strategy based on the auction, the hand on lead, and the 5 Lines of Defense. grizz: I will try to remember to insert the board numbers in the Chat Log, so you can match up the log with the hands file in the future. kyno40: are there any answers to when to lead a singelton or not please ? grizz: singleton side suit or trump? did pard bid the suit? or either op? do you have trump control? grizz: it is not a simple answer! grizz: for instance - sofine: THINK1 grizz: if you have a strong side suit and 4 trumps, you do NOT want to go looking for ruffs grizz: you would rather try to force declarer to ruff and lose control of the hand grizz: in that case even if you do have a stiff, lead your best suit instead grizz: the best indicator for leading a stiff is when you do not have 4 trumps, and don't think pard does either grizz: best of all you have trump control too, the A or K so declarer can't just pull them and get on with his plan grizz: but generally if you do not have the conditions for a Forcing Defense, then a singleton lead in a side suit is a good idea grizz: unless you have AK+ of some other side suit kyno40: thank you grizz: hope that's not too much info, but this is a very complex game grizz: any other opinions on singleton leads? jlco: and a lot of fun :) grizz: mostly importantly! grizz: If you wonder what a GIB bid means, click on it - the bots play 2/1. grizz: JohnnyHiLo: do the bots use signalling and what is it? kyno40: to fast lol jlco: impressive grizz: the bots use these conventions: http://online.bridgebase.com/doc/gib_system_notes.php wyoming33: gib led from an ace:( grizz: and the bots lost me in the dust on this one wyoming33: really had them speeded up LOL jlco: we can look at the movie, and click next grizz: very strange lead! i do not recommend ever leading the Q from that holding, even if pard bid the suit amcs: too fast! grizz: trouble is that if i slow the bots down, they can take forever grizz: let's try another hand grizz: before we do, i have some comments on this one grizz: leading an unsupported ace at a suit contract is rarely a good idea grizz: and underleading and unsupported ace is worse! grizz: even if pard has bid the suit jlco: and what about playing the K on the Q? grizz: that made no sense either! nome: and BOT did both :) jlco: they don't take classes here grizz: it does make sense if W has Kx, as an unblocking play jlco: right, then it would grizz: but there is nothing in dummy that suggests any lead is better coming through dummy grizz: which is the only other reason to gratuitously cover pard's honor grizz: so the lead was bad, and the 3rd hand play was bad grizz: didn't cost them on this one, the !h hook only goes one way and it's onside grizz: but this is BAAAAAAD defense lead! valcam: would 8!c be ok grizz: no, underleading an ace is worse than leading the A sofine: Q!d zewzew: Q!D? kyno40: no i think 5 grizz: !DQ is a fine lead, an honor sequence in a suit not bid or implied by ops wyoming33: if going to play !C for some reason - just lead the ace grizz: yes, i agree sofine: lead Q!d grizz: E deserved to find N with the !KJ! wyoming33: right:) grizz: let us consider strategy before selecting a card Pearls23: what about leading A!c followd by rhe q!c or simply lead trump instead ? zewzew: if A!C is led, would W throw K!C on it to unblock? grizz: E might lead the doubleton !s hoping to set up a ruff, but that's a bad idea when N bid !s - just helps him get the suit established grizz: zewzew, no - unless W has Kx and NEEDS to unblock grizz: there is no need to unblock with Kxxx grizz: just give an encouraging signal, and pard will continue zewzew: ok thx kyno40: has to be a !d but which one grizz: and we already ruled out !cs bfortune: Do the bots do any signals ? grizz: "Carding is 3/5, with what appears to be standard count and attitude signals. Gib does falsecard. " kyno40: the !d5 would promise hon ? grizz: that is from the GIB Convention Card at http://online.bridgebase.com/doc/gib_system_notes.php grizz: so assume standard signals wyoming33: 5 says you dont have a sequence grizz: y, 5 would imply one honor, or a tenace - but deny a sequence grizz: important point about sequence leads - there is a difference between NT and suit defense grizz: vs NT, you like to have a 3-card sequence grizz: like JT9x grizz: or with the 3rd card missing by just 1 spot - JT8x grizz: here is the reason - grizz: if you lead from JTxx, dummy has the A9 and declarer has the K8, declarer ducks and wins, and then hooks you for the T grizz: so vs NT you want a 3 card sequence grizz: but vs suit contracts, most suits don't go 3 rounds without getting ruffed grizz: so a 2-card sequence is fine kyno40: ty grizz: a fine point perhaps, but very useful valcam: why would 5 deny a sequence? grizz: 5 would show 1 honor, or a tenace - something like KJxx kyno40: because it den. a sequ. zewzew: what is a tenace pls? grizz: a tenace is an honor sequence with holes grizz: AQxx grizz: AJxx grizz: KJxx grizz: QTxx zewzew: ok thx grizz: etc grizz: it's an old whist term that survived through the centuries grizz: one other comment on leads - grizz: the scheme for opening leads is very complex grizz: but the rules for tricks 2-13 are simple - small spot card shows interest in that suit AND overrides any previous signals in the auction or play grizz: big spot card denies interest in that suit TonySam: how about hi lo grizz: so if you have KJ872 in a suit that you didn't lead, but have a chance later in the play, lead the 2 not the 7 - the 7 is hard to read as encouraging, but the 2 is crystal clear grizz: Tony, hi-lo in what respect? opening lead? later lead? following pard's lead? following declarer or dummy's lead? TonySam: on pard's lead grizz: on pard's first lead of a suit, your first job is to show Attitude in standard methods grizz: so if you play standard signals, a high card says you like the suit grizz: on the second round of the suit, show Remaining Count, with hi-lo showing even number in standard methods grizz: so let's say you have the 73 in a suit that pard leads grizz: if you have no reason to suggest a switch, signal with the 7 grizz: if you do have a reason to switch, such as holding the AQT in a side suit behind the KJ9 in dummy, then signal with the 3 TonySam: but this contracdicts what you said before about small to show interest? grizz: ah - i was talking about the LEAD, and you were talking about FOLLOWING :) TonySam: ok ty :) grizz: HUUUUUUUGE difference! grizz: here are the basic rules on 3rd hand play grizz: 1. win the trick, unless there is a good reason not to grizz: 2. give Attitude if you do not have to cover it grizz: if Attitude is already known or clearly irrelevant, such as if dummy is now void, then give Suit Preference amcs: attitude? grizz: if you like the suit that pard just led, play a high spot card grizz: that is an Attitude signal grizz: if you hate the suit that pard just led, then play low - that is a stop sign amcs: thx grizz: there are a couple reasons why you might hate the suit grizz: declarer might be short, and another lead might both get ruffed and set up a winner in dummy grizz: you might want pard to stop now, so you can lead the suit through declarer in case he is void grizz: or you might have entries in another suit, and want pard to figure it out and make the killing switch grizz: or you might be void, intending to ruff the suit if pard figures it out grizz: in any of those cases, play a discouraging signal card in 3rd seat - a small card, in standard methods grizz: sidebar grizz: kibs often ask whether they should learn udca, and what the benefits are grizz: Upside Down Count and Attitude, a system that many experts play grizz: and i tell them first to learn what the signals are really for, and how to do it properly in standard methods first grizz: and then we can talk about udca grizz: so i won't be talking much about udca in the BIL, even though i play udca with nearly all of my partners grizz: more important is to learn what signals to give and expect and when grizz: that is, what signals to give, grizz: what signals to expect, grizz: and when grizz: worry about the "how" later grizz: there are advantages to udca, but i won't go into that here grizz: any other questions? these were all good ones! grizz: and many of them were addressed in depth and detail in the lesson archives on my website amcs: attitude is part of standard cding?Pls grizz: absolutely! valcam: if w had the lead what was the best lead? grizz: whenever pard leads a new suit, you should find a way to tell pard whether you like it or not whiz: hi d :) grizz: if W had the lead here vs. 4!h in the South? valcam: y grizz: ok, remember the 5 Lines of Defense? grizz: 1. Forcing grizz: 2. Active grizz: 3. Passive grizz: 4. Reduce ruffs grizz: 5. Create trump tricks grizz: these are in order of effectiveness grizz: if the conditions for Forcing are present, then no other strategy is better grizz: if not, continue down the list wyoming33: shd one lead !H - north is going to be trumping !S grizz: forcing can't work here, neither defender has 4+ trumps grizz: declarer is likely to be trumping !s, true - TonySam: but leading K!D hoping for p to have the ace and then lead the 7? grizz: but there are some other considerations that we must think about grizz: ops have bid 2 suits strongly grizz: !s and !h grizz: trumps are breaking well for declarer, doesn't look like we have any ruffs coming for the D grizz: and when ops have bid 2 suits strongly, that is a reason to hunt for your side suit tricks and cash them before they go away on declarer's good side suit grizz: that is Active Defense grizz: and indicates that W should lead a minor grizz: which one? kyno40: we can imagine from bidding dec hand would be 5422 or 55 21 grizz: !dK can be brilliant, if E has the A and N and S each have 3 grizz: but K can be stupid if S has the A and N has the Q grizz: and small !d will not work well if pard has the A, since the suit blocks on the 2nd round grizz: so small !c would be my choice from the W hand ->kyno40: y grizz: let's do one more hand valcam: ty TonySam: would this be a passive def? grizz: no, this would be Active - looking to establish or cash !cs before they get pitched on !ss isabable: hi i may be wrong but is not e on lead sorry TonySam: ok ty grizz: E is on lead here, but the hypothetical question was what W should lead if W is on lead grizz: grizz: lol grizz: passout wyoming33: dummy again grizz: lol i'm dummy again! Campus61: try again:) nome: good hand for lead grizz: the book says this auction calls for a Passive lead grizz: so a worthless suit, or a sequence grizz: some may try a !c from the doubleton, hoping to catch a ruff later grizz: but ops clearly have the most points, and N does not have a big trump to stop the run of !hs grizz: and doubleton ruffs almost never work anyway grizz: so a Passive Lead is the top of a sequence, or a worthless suit grizz: and just happens to strike pay dirt here spinman: 4 means? grizz: 4 is the highest spot card S can signal with grizz: and seeing no reason not to continue, N continues grizz: if W wins the trick, then leads the A, the trick gets ruffed and the Q is established as a winner for a pitch grizz: so S is better to encourage and hope pard gets the message grizz: and here we have another signal grizz: N does not want S to lead another !d grizz: and hopes that pard can figure out the !s switch grizz: the small !c here shows no interest in !cs, and by inference something in !s grizz: this is a special signal, showing a solid 3-card sequence of QJT grizz: par result, we are only entitled to 2!s and a !d grizz: but on any other lead we don't get those tricks boris3161: how does that special signal work then? I'd have played the 10 wyoming33: with only 2 card seq would play the lower card grizz: W will pull trumps, run the !c and pitch a !d, making 5 grizz: with only a 2-card sequence, follow with the lower one wyoming33: no pitch on !Cs grizz: playing a high one like that is a loud signal, an unexpectedly high card grizz: on a !s lead, declarer wins the next trick unless N switches to a !d JohnnyHiLo: i have a question after this is over if you don't mind. grizz: pulls trump, runs !cs, and pitches the !d making 5 ->JohnnyHiLo: sure grizz: and a !h or !c lead allows the same line of play grizz: so the "book" lead worked well here grizz: at matchpoints, the difference between 4!h and 5!h can be huge grizz: it is quite possible that 5!h would be worth 60%, but 4!h only 30% grizz: Do we have any final questions?. antonio37: tx grizz: That concludes today's lesson, and next week we will have more quiz hands on opening leads. grizz: If anybody needs help retrieving the hand records or chat log, please email me at Grizz@GrizzBridge.com. marialo: tks:) Dianne0516: Thanks for coming Grizz :) grizz: I teach private individual, pair, and small group lessons. If you would like to know more please email me at Grizz@GrizzBridge.com. cdt: thanks Pete enjoyed :) Mary Liz: please show the movie ydannac: THANKS GRIZZ !H!H ladygolf: thanks Pete :) grizz: Thanks also to Maureen, Rosemary, Eileen, Fred and the wonderful people at BBO who make this all possible. Campus61: tks :) boris3161: thanks for being so patient! :) coco24: thanks Grizz:) kyno40: thank you Pete dottyd: many thanks zewzew: thank u v much :)kopykat: TY grizz: Thanks all for coming, i'll see you in a week Mary Liz: ty ty Pearls23: ty Pete for your time you gave to us adamark1: tks:) tasha6: thx Grizz grizz: and i have some questions to answer privately, so will stick around for a few minutes ->boris3161: :) ->zewzew: :) wyoming33: OKAY - I can do it if you tell me what to say and then get off JohnnyHiLo: ok. are you familiar with the suit combination section of the complete encyclopedia of bridge? ->JohnnyHiLo: sure, let's make this public JohnnyHiLo: are you familiar with the suit combination section of the complete encyclopedia of bridge? grizz: sure, it shows most suit combinations, and what the odds are of any given line of play according to a priori probabilities grizz: btw i have not found that online, but would like to do so if it exists anywhere JohnnyHiLo: i find that i can get the obvious ones but many many of them are not obvious to me and they don't show how they arrived at the trick count and fractional trick count grizz: though i have some other online tables with partial informationgrizz: aha - very complicated math involved JohnnyHiLo: the bridgehands.com has a fairly complete section on it grizz: here is another: http://www.automaton.gr/tt/en/OddsTbl.htm JohnnyHiLo: but how to develop a sense of play so that you know that you are playing the combination kosher grizz: hang on for a minute grizz: http://bridgehands.com/P/Probabilities_Miscellaneous.htm grizz: http://bridgehands.com/S/Suit_Combinations.htm grizz: ok, that is the link that i have on the website grizz: so for any given combination, find the one closest to it grizz: there are way too many entries to commit them all to memory grizz: but you can go through the table and look for patterns JohnnyHiLo: right grizz: have you tried out the Bridge Master software on BBO? JohnnyHiLo: does that have a combination or suitplay option? grizz: it is an interactive tutorial on declarer play wyoming33: the free ones - tricky grizz: not as such, but suit combinations is one of the areas covered grizz: there are 5 levels of difficulty grizz: from 1. Beginner to grizz: 5. Mere mortals need not apply JohnnyHiLo: oh yes. most of them are way to hard to work out at the table for me grizz: there are 6 free hands at each level on BBO grizz: and additional hands are $10 for 30 hands, all completely annotated grizz: and many common suit combinations are addressed in those hands grizz: but i have not found a good resource for just Suit Combinations grizz: and if you find one, please let me know grizz: Ron Klinger wrote a book on the subject, and his other work is excellent grizz: but keep one thing in mind - grizz: at the table the bidding, play and signals frequently toss the tables on the scrap heap grizz: so even if you have superhuman memory and CAN memorize them, conditions change at the table JohnnyHiLo: yes. but there are times when you have only one suit where there is a chance of making a bid and combinational knowledge is vital JohnnyHiLo: there is a scandinavian guy who has a free old fashioned program called suit play. he says he is going to develop a windows version that will beep if you play the wrong way grizz: those tables were written as though each suit occurs in a vacuum grizz: oh yeah, he is Dutch - that program was written in DOS and is clunky but technically very good JohnnyHiLo: he SAYS he will make a windows version grizz: but i think cruising through the bridgehands table and looking for patterns is more valuable grizz: take a look at Richard Pavlicek's website too, he has lots of math-related stuff JohnnyHiLo: ok. by the way i got that big red defensive book by kantar and it is really very good grizz: oh yes! hard to grasp and not so well organized, but very comprehensive JohnnyHiLo: yes. much of it is extremely hard in the advanced section. i get 1 out of 10 correct the first time i try them grizz: one other comment on Bridge Master JohnnyHiLo: on pavlicek grizz: if you can play 80% of the Level 3 hands correctly, you can play at any expert table on BBO JohnnyHiLo: im sure grizz: i say that from personal experience grizz: having been terrible at declarer play just 4 years ago JohnnyHiLo: im plowing my way through play of the hand with blackwood grizz: ah grizz: another good resource on play of the hand is an old book, written in the '30s JohnnyHiLo: i can solve 50-60% of those grizz: Play Of The Hand by Watson JohnnyHiLo: yeah. i've read that. quaint languagegrizz: the bidding is old fashioned, but the commentary on declarer play is brilliant and timeless JohnnyHiLo: some of the squeeze play stuff presumes unnatural memory doldridg: Yes abd the revised Watson from 1958 is still in print... grizz: there are better resources on squeezes, but none better on garden variety stuff grizz: ok, i must get ready for my next session in the IAC